State of the Industry "Sportfishing"

[Anthony of the ARK]

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I'd like to hear everyone's opinion on the state of the sportfishing industry, and its future. I am a 21 year old senior in college. I have always wanted to work in this industry I love the boats, the tournaments, the travel and fish of course.

But whenever i think of my future in the industry, it look pretty grim. With the economy and the rising cost of fuel, and the government closing some fisheries that maybe essential to the survival of the industry. It just doesn't seem like a good idea to get into sportfishing anymore then I already am. My logic is that this is a Luxury industry and as much as we think we or other people need to go fishing for sport, but we really dont.

For example what is the first thing that goes when money get tight, "the boat". And who does that effect. The professional crew if its a big boat, also the mechanic, the tackle store owner and employees, the marina that the boat was at and its employees, and all other boat and fishing businesses.

I feel like in may 3 years of being a "professional" if you can call it that, in the industry i feel ive watched it shrink, as more slips are empty and more boat sitting at the dock. I know the boat i work on has steadily seem a down turn in our trips, over the last 3 years. hopefully its not cuz the mate sucks.

So im wondering what do you guys and gals think, id like to hear from consumers, boat and tackle dealers, captains, mates, boat owners, web site managers, mechanics and everyone else.

Be honest and dont hold back because for a lot of people this great industry is a source of survival some of us and sanity for others. And i feel that the next few years are crucial for the survival of the Industry.

[SkirtChaser32']

I would agree with you that things do seem pretty grim for the future of the sportfishing/charter industry. I started fishing in a time when it was booming, which was a little over a decade ago. Any day 20kts or less, ALL of the charter fleet was fishing. Things have certainly changed. This is definitely a luxury pastime and with the way things are currently with the economy, your "average joe", who used to come down to Hatteras for a week and go on an offshore charter, may still be coming to the beach for a week, but he sure as hell isn't spending any money that is not absolutely necessary.. It is sad to see such a unique industry like sportfishing take such a hard hit, and I really hope that one day, it will make a come back. Unfortunately, I do not see this happening any time soon....But hey! we did have a couple of guys just get elected that don't want to squeeze "average joe" for every penny he has to re-distribute the wealth...so maybe there is hope!

[jawz12]

buisness sucks,plain and simple...there are no builder,that i'm aware of that are busy right now...some sales people may tell you so,truth is,nothing's going on...here's a fact...new york boat show,a big company,one that "went under" boater's world,didn't make their "show money",meaning,their space didn't pay for itself...sad huh ??
personally,i do not know of a marina that had a busy service dept all season long-i know a large facility that is "week to week",i know another one a little north of me that has been out of work since august...it's a sad state for the marine industry right now...i've never been slow in the time i've been self employed-i am now,been so all season long...
i'm pulling boats for the winter season,just for my own information,i've been running efi checks,to find out how many hrs the boat was used-i recorded the number in the spring when i launched the boat...it's not good...one onwer put a whopping 5.7hrs on his boat...
what's gonna happen ??? i got no clue...

take a look at the used boats for sale...prices are at an all time low...basically,you can't give a boat away.i can't believe some of the deals i have seen-this tells you what's going on...
same deal with rv's...

charter guys ??? man i feel bad for these guys,fisheries closed-sea bass-there's alot of boats in my area that run all winter for the big sea bass,these guys lost that now...the charter buisness has got to have been pretty hard hit...

[capt. jakeg]

Like you said, its a luxury industry and when people don't have money, they arent going fishing. It isnt just the sportfishing industry thats hurting now, its the entire marine industry in general as well as the entire economy all the way through. People are more worried about paying thier mortgage than going fishing.

I just bought a boat in July. You are from Ocean city and have probably seen the boat that I got. I got the old ray davis boat "lucky lines" that was parked right next door to AKE marine. With the work it has had done to it, I would have expected to pay around 300k for the boat that I bought if I would have bought it five years ago. Its a great classic carolina boat, with over 200k in upgrades-new motors, new genset, 2 new ac units, new interior, new riggers, new electronics, new props, fresh paint, etc. Just a lot of work done to it. I bought the boat for 80k. Right now its pretty much name your price on boats because banks will not lend money on them whatsoever. Also, there are so many repos out there flooding the market that boats are basically worthless at the moment.
If there is one good thing about the economy being bad, its that if you can stand on your feet in business now, when it comes back, your business will be in great shape. I feel like that is true for any business right now. The competition has thinned out. Hopefully its not completely damaged beyond repair.

For me, my business is lower than I would like it to be at. I fished about 160 trips this year, which is a good number of trips, but looking back through my book the vast majority of those trips are gonna be half day inshore trips. I have noticed the majority of my business has moved from being offshore to inshore. Simple reason being that people cannot afford to spend $1500 to go offshore, but $550 for a couple hours is doable. I am not going to complain about it though. The way things are at this time with the economy, I will take what I can get, work my ass of for the customers I do have, and be thankful to be on the water when I am there. Luckily, I don't have 300k in boat payments to make or I wouldnt be able to keep my head above water.

Don't get me started on govt regulations. All I can say about that is the vast majority of somebody somewhere voted for these assholes we got in there now and they are about as smart as the idiots who voted them in. For some reason the phrase "I told you so" is bitterly stuck on my tongue.

[Captain Michael Buffington]

Originally Posted by capt. jakeg

Like you said, its a luxury industry and when people don't have money, they arent going fishing. It isnt just the sportfishing industry thats hurting now, its the entire marine industry in general as well as the entire economy all the way through. People are more worried about paying thier mortgage than going fishing.

I just bought a boat in July. You are from Ocean city and have probably seen the boat that I got. I got the old ray davis boat "lucky lines" that was parked right next door to AKE marine. With the work it has had done to it, I would have expected to pay around 300k for the boat that I bought if I would have bought it five years ago. Its a great classic carolina boat, with over 200k in upgrades-new motors, new genset, 2 new ac units, new interior, new riggers, new electronics, new props, fresh paint, etc. Just a lot of work done to it. I bought the boat for 80k. Right now its pretty much name your price on boats because banks will not lend money on them whatsoever. Also, there are so many repos out there flooding the market that boats are basically worthless at the moment.
If there is one good thing about the economy being bad, its that if you can stand on your feet in business now, when it comes back, your business will be in great shape. I feel like that is true for any business right now. The competition has thinned out. Hopefully its not completely damaged beyond repair.

For me, my business is lower than I would like it to be at. I fished about 160 trips this year, which is a good number of trips, but looking back through my book the vast majority of those trips are gonna be half day inshore trips. I have noticed the majority of my business has moved from being offshore to inshore. Simple reason being that people cannot afford to spend $1500 to go offshore, but $550 for a couple hours is doable. I am not going to complain about it though. The way things are at this time with the economy, I will take what I can get, work my ass of for the customers I do have, and be thankful to be on the water when I am there. Luckily, I don't have 300k in boat payments to make or I wouldnt be able to keep my head above water.

Don't get me started on govt regulations. All I can say about that is the vast majority of somebody somewhere voted for these assholes we got in there now and they are about as smart as the idiots who voted them in. For some reason the phrase "I told you so" is bitterly stuck on my tongue.

I wish I had your diplomacy

Mike

[BlueH20Boss]

Anthony, I feel your pain man...Ever since i was a little kid i dreamed of owning a big charter boat one day, and every day that dream shrinks a little more seeing how the industry is taking it on the chin in this recession we are in. I am 24, i have been fishing offshore for about 10 of those years, and inshore fishing and general boating since before i could walk. I know how you feel to be at the age where its decision time, and i got into construction at a young age, went to college and graduated, and continued on with my own company, always thinking someday if things got really good i could buy a boat and have a charter business alongside my contracting business. Well needless to say, BOTH industries i dipped my feet into are doing pretty bad, but all i can say is '' You can't change the wind but you can adjust your sails" I am with you that its getting worse the last 4 or 5 years, but i think i speak for both of us that even if we don't make a million sportfishing, we will love the sport and take part in it as much as we can for as long as we live. Hopefully someday it will be like "the good old days" that me and you missed out on haha! I guess all i can say is i am grateful to have the first mate position on two private boats, i will take all i can get at this point!

Kevin

[Capt. Lyndon]

I agree with everyone. Like Jake, between charters and private boat work, I've run somewhere in the neighborhood of 120 trips this year, with the majority being 1/2 days. In years past, it's been about 50/50 half days v/s full days. I'm hoping the economy will turn around and we'll all see an increase. I wouldn't suggest anyone go into this buisness right now.

[frankypettolina]

I agree with alot of what has been said here. For the most part, the business is in the toilet. This was the worst charter season for the Last Call ever. Period. We ran less trips this year than we did our first in the business. THings were bad in the recession of the early nineties, but not this bad.

Boat builders are slow, boat work is hard to find. Some very talented captains and mates have been out of work for some time, with no prospects.

MY marine surveying business has been the same for the past 5 years. I have a steady business from insurance renewals and claims. My pre purchase is the same as it has been volume wise, the biggest difference is that the purchases are bank repo's and "deals of the century." The good news for me is that my pre purchase rate is the same whether they are paying top or bottom dollar for the boat.

That being said, I know some surveyors, especially those new to the biz that are suffering. This is my 15th year in the biz, so I am established. I also know some surveyors (mostly those that specialize in claims work) that are busier than usual.

As far as where I see it going? I agree with Jake that the charter boats that survive will have better business down the road. Many will not survive though.

Bluewater sportfishing, historically speaking, was never a blue collar man's game. THe event of "pocket" sportfishing boats, the GPS and 20 mile out tuna chunking made it affordable for the blue collar man. A strong economy in the late 90's early 2000's made chartering an option for the blue collar man. Unfortunately, the blue collar man has lost 20 mile chunking and the strong economy. Those same blue collar guys are also losing work and cannot make the payments on their pocket sportfisherman, or they cannot aford to use them anymore. The way I see it is that the sport will go back to being more of a white collar pastime.

Blue collar guys will still go, just not as much, or they will rediscover bluefish, sharks and bottom fishing.

Boat repairs, boat builders and boat captains will have a harder and harder time finding work due to lack of demand. THose that survive will have more work in the future, but only those that survive.

I am 15 years into fishing or surveying 12 months of the year- with 10 summers fishing before that, and some boatwashing before that. I don't know how to do anything else (but hey I have degrees in English and Philosophy- that will really help) I will do my best to weather this economy and hope for the best down the road.

For you younger guys- I would have a contingency plan if I were you- I am not telling you not to fish or to pursue the career- I am just telling you to have a plan B.

For guys like Jawz and Jake and myself- here's to surviving my friends- lets hope for the best.

[capt. jakeg]

Originally Posted by frankypettolina

For you younger guys- I would have a contingency plan if I were you- I am not telling you not to fish or to pursue the career- I am just telling you to have a plan B.

For guys like Jawz and Jake and myself- here's to surviving my friends- lets hope for the best.

Contingency plan? if I had it all to do over again, I'd get a law degree, go through seminary and be a minister, or go into politics. Go where the moneys at. At this point charter boat capts aint in for the money, we are in it because we are doing what we love. Lawyers love money, ministers love god, and politicians love themselves. Either way at the end of the day, they have a paycheck for what they love and they didnt have to work their fingers to the bone to get it.

Franky, I hope we all survive it and can laugh about it ten years from now, but its a tough road right now.

[Squidnation]

The industry is in a sad state. From the boat building industry to the marine retail industry to the charter industry. But the woes are temporary and cylicical. Goods time will be back and as Jake says, the ones that can hang on and provide a good service now are going to thrive in the near future. But to do nothing but wait for that tide to turn is gonna kill many a business in this industry.

There is a great billboard in Salisbury that says Bill Gates started Microsoft during a recession. I guess that means that there is a way Anth. I can only speak as a marketer and I know that I have learned quite a bit being in this industry. This industry is slow, very slow to adapt to new ideas. This site is a prime example. Companies and individuals have at their fingertips an enormous market that can be targeted free of charge or at a nominal rate if one chooses. But in the grand scheme of things you see very few individuals and companies taking advantage of such tools.

Also where some industries are failing others are thriving. Call me crazy but if I were a business owner that relied on customers with a large amount of discretionary income I might be targeting that industry. I am mostly thinking of the charter industry. I have a few clients that I help generate business for and believe when I tell you that targeting the boat show, fishing rags and flyers is not only stale but also expensive. But many folks would rather put their efforts into complaining about the state of the industry then putting their efforts into marketing their product.

Just today I was speaking to a friend that is starting a charter business. I have no doubt he is gonna succeed. I will not say his name because he would kill me. But he spoke about how his response has been incredibly successful in an area where there are very few charter operations but a large amount of tourists and incredible fishing. But he is not attacking the market advertising in fishing rags or creating a generic flyer to put in a tackle store. He has pinpointed industries that are thriving and marketing to those in that industry. Novel idea and it is paying off.

The manner in which you approached your topic has more failure in it then you would think (BTW - I can talk to him like this - he is my nephew) I think I would have worded it - How can I thrive in this industry? What can I do to make it better? and what are some of the success stories that you industry guys are willing to share. Keep your attitude high and figure out a way to do what you love. Call me - I have some ideas that I think will help.