What is a "Carolina" boat?

[Fortunate One]

Thanks for posting that Capt. Jon Tennant.

That's a bit of great boat building history there.

I love the descriptions of the preferred methods from each builder.

I'm a music lover as well as a student of boat building and in my world these guys are just are important as the great old blues artists.

It's unfortunate that most of the construction methods are a lost art and have been cast aside for the latest and greatest, fastest most cost effective construction.

Although some modern builders produce their boats with the latest construction materials and they may be good strong boats but can you really beat a properly constructed epoxy and solid wood hull?

Boat building has certainly come a long way from it's roots and in my opinion it's not necessarily a good thing.

And like the roots for present day rock and roll how ironic is it that over a decade ago Gibson guitar started manufacturing instruments in the specification of how they did it in the late 50's. And they charge a huge premium for those instruments.

Some things just don't get better with technology.

There comes a point when certain things are built to perfection and constructed with methods that need not improvement.

And based on those thoughts as my logic, I've had a boat built that has taken much of the early knowledge and carried it forward to present day.

Granted on my boat I've used a combination of a Florida style combined with an early New England wood/epoxy builder as well as using a modified carolina flair.

And I'm sure the result is going to be a rock solid wood/glass boat that will have a ride that would be admired by the first builders with vision.

[gottaflylee]

Guess you did not read my post and only looked at the pictures

Originally Posted by krazy8
Originally Built In North Carolina

Oh but I did..."Originally Built In North Carolina" thats all you wrote, now as what you were trying to get accross, I have no idea other that it cane off as I posted..."Just because my Southern Skimmer is built in Beaufort NC, does not make it a "Carolina" boat, it justs makes it built in North Carolina... "

one more time...
Just because a boat is made in NC does not make it a "Carolina" boat...It is just made in North Carolina.

Great pictures of the "Bite Me" Jay, Buddy Canandy is another great Carolina boat builder out of Wanchese NC.


As I understand, this is an "Island Boat Works" boat...Doug Grant owner.

[krazy8]

one more time...
Just because a boat is made in NC does not make it a "Carolina" boat...It is just made in North Carolina.

I think what you are trying to say is Carolina Style Boat

[Ace1st]

Oh but I did..."Originally Built In North Carolina" thats all you wrote, now as what you were trying to get accross, I have no idea other that it cane off as I posted..."Just because my Southern Skimmer is built in Beaufort NC, does not make it a "Carolina" boat, it justs makes it built in North Carolina... "

one more time...
Just because a boat is made in NC does not make it a "Carolina" boat...It is just made in North Carolina.

Great pictures of the "Bite Me" Jay, Buddy Canandy is another great Carolina boat builder out of Wanchese NC.


As I understand, this is an "Island Boat Works" boat...Doug Grant owner.

LEE... I thought AGITATOR was a HERITAGE Boatworks? Maybe Im wrong. IMO.....A "TRUE"carolina boat, is built by just a few...... BUDDY CANADY, BUDDY HARRIS, BOBBY SULLIVAN, TERRY GUTHRIE still build em one piece at a time by hand. I know Paul Mann, Paul Spencer, John Bayliss, and all those other high end Carolina Boats were all influenced by Warren Oneil and Omie Tillet. But they no longer build then the same way. They do exemplify the Carolina Style but to me Only a few build them the old way. If I did win the lottery, one of the above four old time builders would be my choice. And Capt BC would probably be at the top of my list.

[gottaflylee]

LEE... I thought AGITATOR was a HERITAGE Boatworks? Maybe Im wrong. IMO.....A "TRUE"carolina boat, is built by just a few...... BUDDY CANADY, BUDDY HARRIS, BOBBY SULLIVAN, TERRY GUTHRIE still build em one piece at a time by hand. I know Paul Mann, Paul Spencer, John Bayliss, and all those other high end Carolina Boats were all influenced by Warren Oneil and Omie Tillet. But they no longer build then the same way. They do exemplify the Carolina Style but to me Only a few build them the old way. If I did win the lottery, one of the above four old time builders would be my choice. And Capt BC would probably be at the top of my list.

Could be Ace, I know it was built 1 place and finished another, thus my confusion on this boat...Trophy John will know hope he sees this thread as he will have some interesting thoughts on this thread...

[canyongear]

She's got a nice nose, hello maine ..........

[Avenger]

Great discussion.

This here is a carolina boat.....

It sure is. I'll bet in a headwind you get some serious lift from that flare. Still a beautiful boat though. Thanks for posting it.

Avenger I think this is what they consider the "hawk" from the definaitions posted out of the book.

That's how I'm seeing it too. A reverse curve to bring the flare and stem together. I guess it's just the way they worded it that's unclear to me.

For what its worth your Hat looks like a Carolina boat to me. It may not be as exaggerated as the newer boats or some of the builders, but it has all of the style features.

Thanks, I still view it as a Carolina boat too. As you say, being older it doesn't look like newer boats such as the Bite Me, but I'll bet that if you find a traditional Carolina Custom from 1970 it won't look like the Bite Me either. While that boat has more flare than my personal taste prefers I'll say that mine having more flare wouldn't be a bad thing. To quote Pascoe, "Hatts throw water like a busted hydrant." and it can get soggy on the bridge sometimes.

Capt Jon. Thanks for posting the history lesson. From that, I want to look at Buddy Davis in particular. He started out building plank on frame and gradually moved through different building methods until he got to a molded fiberglass, let's say, semi-custom boat. Setting aside for a moment preferences in construction methods, when did that cease to be a Carolina boat? All the features remained right up to the present except that it's no longer a "Custom" Carolina. How do we draw the line when to the observerer and the operator there's no readily apparent difference?

I understand the allegience to traditional building methods. On the other hand, if we didn't accept change at some point we'd still be blowboaters.

[Capt. Jon Tennant]

Setting aside for a moment preferences in construction methods, when did that cease to be a Carolina boat? All the features remained right up to the present except that it's no longer a "Custom" Carolina. How do we draw the line when to the observerer and the operator there's no readily apparent difference?

I understand the allegience to traditional building methods. On the other hand, if we didn't accept change at some point we'd still be blowboaters.

If your talking about what an original carolina boat is, then I believe the traditional building methods would apply & here's why I say that-

A master carpenter can be trained to build from jigs and plans... workers can be trained to build from a mold... engineers can figure outstanding things with today's technology and be right on the money..... but the main thing that comes to mind with an original carolina boat is that it takes a artist to create a work of that magnitude with only his eyes and his hands. the carolina style boats of today have came a long way from the original ways of doing things.... not to say that is a bad thing at all. I would be proud to have either, but in my opinion that is the difference.

I really like the the hatts, just would not consider it a traditional carolina boat in the way it was built, but it very much has the carolina style and ain't a thing wrong with that. here's a little history on the hatts I had saved from the same place, i thought you would like...


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the scene was Oregon Inlet, but it could just as easily have been Hatteras Inlet or Ocracoke Inlet, all ports integrally linked to big game fishing lore and boat building tradition. It would be correct to say that building sport fishing boats on the Outer Banks began with legendary captain Ernal Foster and his Albatross boats, but when considering the impact on the boating world as a whole, Outer Banks boat-building history was made on a day Willis Slane couldn't fish.

During May 1959, Slane and his colleagues of the Hatteras Marlin Club were faced with northeasters that made running Hatteras Inlet a suicidal proposition. The big breakers and strong headseas overmatched any of the boats available at the time. Slane, a hosiery manufacturer from High Point, North Carolina, and evidently not a person who calmly accepted changes in his itinerary, vowed to find a boat made of fiberglass able to fish in the bad seas so common to the Outer Banks. Legend has it that a colleague dared Slane to build the boat himself. Thus, Slane founded Hatteras Yachts on little more than an idea, a set of plans by Jack Hargrave, and a dare from a bored fisherman.

On the morning of March 22, 1960, Slane launched his boat, a 41- foot convertible named Knit Wits. The boat was everything Slane had hoped for. Knit Wits was used briefly as a demo boat for Slane's fledgling company before being sold to Sam Robinson and
W. B. Brooks of New Orleans.

From this beginning, Slane led his company to the highest echelons of the boat building industry. Hatteras Yachts, purchased by GenMar in 1985, now has manufacturing facilities in both High Point and New Bern, North Carolina and is the largest production manufacturer of yachts over 40 feet in length. Hatteras has not strayed very far from Hargrave's original hull design, but a tremendous amount of research is applied to new materials and production. The company is currently working in three-dimensional computer-aided development as well as computerized manufacturing. From its inception, Hatteras has been very successful in producing both motor yachts and sportsfishermen. The company's attention to the offshore fishing scene waned during the late 70s and early 80s, but Hatteras has recently taken a higher profile in the sports fishing arena and has had good results from their
56-foot demo boat, Hatterascal. With Captain Ron Locke on the bridge, Hatterascal won the Hatteras Marlin Club's tournament in 1989, bringing WilliS Slane's flagship to the winner's circle at the Birthplace of the idea. One wonders what Slane would have thought of the air-conditioned flying bridge.

[Bligh]

If your talking about what an original carolina boat is, then I believe the traditional building methods would apply & here's why I say that-

A master carpenter can be trained to build from jigs and plans... workers can be trained to build from a mold... engineers can figure outstanding things with today's technology and be right on the money..... but the main thing that comes to mind with an original carolina boat is that it takes a artist to create a work of that magnitude with only his eyes and his hands. the carolina style boats of today have came a long way from the original ways of doing things.... not to say that is a bad thing at all. I would be proud to have either, but in my opinion that is the difference.

I really like the the hatts, just would not consider it a traditional carolina boat in the way it was built, but it very much has the carolina style and ain't a thing wrong with that. here's a little history on the hatts I had saved from the same place, i thought you would like...


--------------------------------------------------------------------------
the scene was Oregon Inlet, but it could just as easily have been Hatteras Inlet or Ocracoke Inlet, all ports integrally linked to big game fishing lore and boat building tradition. It would be correct to say that building sport fishing boats on the Outer Banks began with legendary captain Ernal Foster and his Albatross boats, but when considering the impact on the boating world as a whole, Outer Banks boat-building history was made on a day Willis Slane couldn't fish.

During May 1959, Slane and his colleagues of the Hatteras Marlin Club were faced with northeasters that made running Hatteras Inlet a suicidal proposition. The big breakers and strong headseas overmatched any of the boats available at the time. Slane, a hosiery manufacturer from High Point, North Carolina, and evidently not a person who calmly accepted changes in his itinerary, vowed to find a boat made of fiberglass able to fish in the bad seas so common to the Outer Banks. Legend has it that a colleague dared Slane to build the boat himself. Thus, Slane founded Hatteras Yachts on little more than an idea, a set of plans by Jack Hargrave, and a dare from a bored fisherman.

On the morning of March 22, 1960, Slane launched his boat, a 41- foot convertible named Knit Wits. The boat was everything Slane had hoped for. Knit Wits was used briefly as a demo boat for Slane's fledgling company before being sold to Sam Robinson and
W. B. Brooks of New Orleans.

From this beginning, Slane led his company to the highest echelons of the boat building industry. Hatteras Yachts, purchased by GenMar in 1985, now has manufacturing facilities in both High Point and New Bern, North Carolina and is the largest production manufacturer of yachts over 40 feet in length. Hatteras has not strayed very far from Hargrave's original hull design, but a tremendous amount of research is applied to new materials and production. The company is currently working in three-dimensional computer-aided development as well as computerized manufacturing. From its inception, Hatteras has been very successful in producing both motor yachts and sportsfishermen. The company's attention to the offshore fishing scene waned during the late 70s and early 80s, but Hatteras has recently taken a higher profile in the sports fishing arena and has had good results from their
56-foot demo boat, Hatterascal. With Captain Ron Locke on the bridge, Hatterascal won the Hatteras Marlin Club's tournament in 1989, bringing WilliS Slane's flagship to the winner's circle at the Birthplace of the idea. One wonders what Slane would have thought of the air-conditioned flying bridge.

My deceased good friend Capt ron jones of the 46 warren Oneal jersey devil fame who fished out of hatteras marlin club for such a long time didnt even know where he was? Oh he did catch a world record blue marlin out of hatteras inlet. and then tried to weigh the fish at the hatteras marlin club? It broke the imbers holding the scale in the air. They had to put the fish back in the boat and run the 30 some miles up the sound to oregon inlet fishing center to weigh the fish? I guess he didnt know he was already at oregon inlet? Mr tennent has the history of warren and the manteo wanchese boat building down pat. He should write a history book on roanoke island boat building. Now having known capt r jones since I was a kid and having him bring me to the marlin club and feeling like I was traveling with an ernest hemingway type famous person. I used to talk to mr foster way back when on windy days when he could not fish.His albatros boat business and boats were confiscated by the US government during WW2 that was back in 1941 to 1945. He told me he had to fight the govt to get his boats back after the war? So that makes his boats the oldest true carolina boats still working and catching fish. He also told me that His boat was built in harkers island I believe or the willis boat works which was just before you went out to harkers island. I am going by memory from way back when? Now he told me a story that the original carolina boats were built in harkers island area and that they used carpenters that had worked for Rybovich in florida who didnt want to live in hot buggy florida any more?. He also told me warren was a few years behind the harker island rybovich broken shear carolina style. The original warren oneals did not have near the flair of the boats today.They did have the rybovich broken shear. So capt john tennet did a great job and I only know what old deceased people like capt jones and mister foster told me. For some reason I was introduced to him as mr foster and thats all I ever called him? Did you know he had the first set of outriggers in carolina? Thats what he told me.

[Capt. Jon Tennant]

My deceased good friend Capt ron jones of the 46 warren Oneal jersey devil fame who fished out of hatteras marlin club for such a long time didnt even know where he was? Oh he did catch a world record blue marlin out of hatteras inlet. and then tried to weigh the fish at the hatteras marlin club? It broke the imbers holding the scale in the air. They had to put the fish back in the boat and run the 30 some miles up the sound to oregon inlet fishing center to weigh the fish? I guess he didnt know he was already at oregon inlet? .

I believe the club was at hatteras.... here's the first part of the story I left out when I copyed and pasted. It should make more sense about oregon inlet being the scene. And I believe all this info I've posted came from Buddy Davis but I can't remember for sure where I found and saved it from...



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As the murky gray of the false dawn begins to lighten with the rising sun, stacks of 10 foot breakers fall across the channel of Oregon Inlet. This is the first day of a mid-September cold front, and the offshore fishing for white marlin should be well worth the price of admission. In the inlet, the outgoing tide is being met by a northeast breeze of nearly 20 knots. The charter boats, all-custom built in the now famous Carolina style, leave their marina on Pamlico Sound. The boats form a long string as they run under the tall bridge and on out into the breakers.

In the cockpit of the second boat, a young angler is running the inlet for the first time. He leans out and looks down the hull at the dark, cresting seas. The first boat leans into a wave and disappears down the backside. On the bridge of the second boat, the captain slows the single diesel to zero thrust and then goes to half throttle as the bow rises. The boat launches down the backside and hits the second breaker full on. The hull's knife-like entry punches through the wave and sends a green wall of water down the flared bow onto the face of the temporarily paralyzed angler. The wooden boat pushes through four more breakers

In this case, the scene was Oregon Inlet, but it could just as easily have been Hatteras Inlet or Ocracoke Inlet, all ports integrally..............................................