Bigger Fish

[twofinbluna]

This is a site for sportfishermen right ? Not save all the fish for the Stickboat , fish 130's out of the corner.com

The site has a commercial section.

Hey Bigeye, If you dont like what I post, dont read it. If you think its all about saving fish for the commercial fishery you are insane. You can take offense to the post or you can open your eyes and realize that its important that people treat the fishery right if you want to have it in the future and that means having this discussion. I cannot tell you how many posts I have read on fishing sites the last 3 or 4 years about people breaking off fish left and right and having people talk about it like its no big deal. I think part of the problem is that nobody ever has this discussion we are having here since people always seem to take it the wrong way. The bottom line is that hundreds of people come and read this stuff and if we are not setting a good example, we are only doing harm to this fishery. The reason I started this thread was not to pick on anyone or to try and make people go out and buy millions in new gear or to cause arguments, but to get this discussion out in the open because its important.

And by the way, we have a charter boat, too.

[twofinbluna]

Chris, you raise a great issue here. For me and my shop we have always been about the right size tackle for the size of the fish that are out there. However I do support the right to chase these fish with the spinning gear as long as you have stepped up the gear. The spining reels and rods that can land these class fish are not cheap and you have to step it up if you really want to have a shot at this class of fish. Once you catch one and land it and harvest it, you should put the light tackle away and brake out the big rods so you can release these fish healthy. Now I am not talking about the professional guides who get all this, I am talking about the average rec. angler. This is why I never spin cast for these fish. Never have and never will. Not my game. I am all about catching numbers and getting clean releases. These fish will survive if you keep the fight times down and if the fish are tired you must swim and revive them and they will live. It has been an awesome start to the season so far so it's up to all of us to make releasing as importan as the catching. Capt. Eric

Well said, Eric.

[twofinbluna]

I own both a Shimano Stella 18000SW and 4 Tiagra 50WLRSA's and haven't been spooled ,or even come close on either. I don't think it is fair to pick on the gear or recomend to people to buy bigger gear but instead lets talk about the individuals fighting the fish. Angling technique and boat handling have more to to do with whether a fish is caught or dropped more than anything else.

Dan, you are not the one I am worried about. The problem is that very few people are going to be able to afford a Stella and many of those that can probably are not going to use it right. I have seen guys out using gear that would not be able to catch a 40 incher, let alone a 70 incher! I agree with you and feel that if everyone had the right spinning gear, with the right sized line, and knew how to use it than we would have nothing to worry about. But, as Eric mentioned, this is about the average people not the really experienced fishermen and guides. Do you really think its best to be promoting the use of spin gear on 65-70+ inch fish to someone who cannot afford the right spin gear and does not know how to fight a fish?

And those 50s are good reels, I wish more people were out there using those. Or the TLD 50s for those who cannot afford the Tiagras or Penns.

[twofinbluna]

Just a side note again on what an important part "knowing what you are doing" plays in this game...

I saw two guys 3 weeks ago loose 3 fish throughout the day at the boat fishing live bait on the SWC. He had 80's on bent butts in a well made stand-up harness .... the guy at the helm had no freakin clue which way to turn, which direction the fish was running ect.... All we could here was him screaming at the top of his lungs and swearing at the guy at the helm.....it was a comedy show.....

My point is that you can have the boat and all the equipment but need an experienced crew on board to play this game.
AT

Could not agree more, Alloy. I should have been more clear in the original post to highlight the need for proper technique (both with boat and rod).

[Tuna Meltdown]

Do you really think its best to be promoting the use of spin gear on 65-70+ inch fish to someone who cannot afford the right spin gear and does not know how to fight a fish?

Chris, I agree that we can no longer catch these fish with any consistancy with the spinning gear we used 4-5 years ago when the fish were 60-100 pounds. Back then Penn 9500SS reels were the goto reel and Shimano Baitrunners, Thunnus, and Fin-nor's would handle these fish. That is no longer the case. I am no expert at catching these sized fish on spinning gear. Hell, I'm 0-4 this season. I would STRONGLY recomend that people wishing to hook up and land these fish in a timely fashion talk to someone who does it for a living. There are plenty of people on this site and others who are out there everyday catching 60+" bluefin on spinning gear for a living. Some of them are out fishing the troll fleet. I would strongly recomend to anyone looking for the right gear speak to either Capt. Dom, Capt. Terry, Firstlight, Stew, or even go read Gman's Thread Gmans intro to Casting to Big Game Fish.

[Bruce H]

Is there any consensus regarding how long this "bling" remains with the fish? I don't recall seeing a post about a fish being caught with a previous "sportsmen's" gear embedded?

[KP161]

I agree with much of what is being said but I don't agree that all these fish that are spooling rods will die. I don't think we're giving these bigger fish enough credit. In my opinion 9 out of 10 of the big fish that spool a rod will be just fine if it was a J hook being used. Especially if on a spreader bar. Big fish are smart and love to shake their head to throw hooks. That spreader bar creates a ton of leverage for the fish to toss the hook too. They've learned this over the years as a way to get away and it's their second line of defense after the initial run. I'm talking 70-80" fish. 60-65" fish pretty much just run and that's that.

So after being spooled that 78" fish is going to double back on all that line, create a ton of slack and start shaking his head in the direction of the pressure and your $100 spreader bar is going to be on the ocean floor and the tuna is going to go about his day. They do this when hooked and an angler is trying his best to stay tight (ask the guys who were with me the last 2 large fish we lost) so what would be different when the tuna has nothing (angler or boat) doing their best to stay tight?

I assume those bigeye someone mentioned were all hooked on bars with J hooks or green machines with J hooks or whatever with J hooks so I think they tossed those hooks in short order and are ready to spool or shake their heads in the near future

Now a big assed popper with 2 trebles in the side of a tuna's face is a different story but after broken off I'd be willing to bet 50% of those fish shake the hooks in a few hours.

All we're doing by breaking big fish off is teaching them how to fight. Training them how to get away. Ask someone who's caught some big fish. Most big tuna try 4-5 dinstinct things (run high, shake their head etc. etc.) to get away because they have used the same thing in the past to get away. The more moves a fish has the more times it's been hooked and gotten away.

Now being spooled with a single circle hook and 500 yards of line that fish might have an issue on it's hands (I mean fins). But I still think they might be ok for the most part becasue of these 2 experinces....

Buddy of mine hooked a 450lb class fish and fought it for about 30 minutes. Line breaks with about 100 yards of 250 lb mono trailing the fish. They go back to fishing. Friend of theirs an hour later about a 1/2 mile away hooks up and gets the fish. You guessed it, the fish had the hook in it's mouth and was trailing the 100 yards of mono.

Caught a 500lb class fish on stellwagon. The fish had about 50 yards of 800lb class mono trailing it and at the end of the 50 yards there was this big ball of 800lb class mono and a balloon type object which must have been creating plenty of drag in the water. The 800lb class mono and hook was definitley long line gear. Mono was huge. I'm not sure where this fish picked up long line gear but it was no where near stellwagon, I'm sure was dragging it for a couple of days and the fish was just fine. Fine until the harpoon came into play I guess.

If you read this far thanks for reading and I can't believe I'm sitting behind a desk right now with this weather instead of fishing.

[54bullwinkle]

KP

Interesting stuff. I wont say that anyone has the right answer, however pulling 10+ or so pounds of drag around will def kill most of the fish sooner or later whether it is spreader bar or line. You dont know how long your fish were pulling that gear around. Prob not long.
Nobody wants to lose a fish or their gear. We all want lost and released fish to have the best chance, that's all.

[KP161]

KP

Interesting stuff. I wont say that anyone has the right answer, however pulling 10+ or so pounds of drag around will def kill most of the fish sooner or later whether it is spreader bar or line. You dont know how long your fish were pulling that gear around. Prob not long.
Nobody wants to lose a fish or their gear. We all want lost and released fish to have the best chance, that's all.

I agree. A fish that can't shake a hook and has to drag gear will probably die. Especially smaller fish. 500lber in my opinion can drag 10lbs around for a long, long time and the hook might rust out, fall out etc. I was just saying I believe these bigger fish are pretty good at shaking J hooks in short order. Unfortunately I can attest to that I'm all for doing what's right to protect these fish for the future. I fish medium/heavy gear and quick healthy releases of small fish. I'm not so good on the healthy release of bigger fish though

[rirockhound]

This is a site for sportfishermen right ? Not save all the fish for the Stickboat , fish 130's out of the corner.com

The site has a commercial section.

To be a sportsman, to me, means that you catch the fish you want to eat, kill them quickly, and release the others with the MAXIMUM chance of survival.

Maybe someone elese definition is different.