Further Attempts to Consolidate Executive Branch Powers to Indefinitely Imprison American Citizens Without Charge

[longfisher]

"There’s been a lot of controversy around two specific sections of Senate Bill S. 1253 “The National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA)” that was rushed to the Senate floor today. They are sections 1031 and 1032, which are both related to the detention of terror suspects. Section 1031 would apparently give the President the power to order the military to subject United States Citizens and other persons present in the United States to indefinite detention without trial or charge. The standards do not even require an allegation or proof beyond a reasonable doubt that the detained person caused harm to the United States. The minimal standards are mere membership or support of a recognized terrorist group. That means a Christian relief worker could end up in indefinite military detention without charge or trial for giving food or medical assistance to someone who turns out to have been a Taliban member or supporter. The new powers are not limited to threats to the United States either but to unspecific ‘coalition partners’. Section 1032 another very problematic section would put citizens and others detained in the United States under military control.

There has been a lot of push back against both of these sections from multiple different sources included the Department of Defense, Senate Judiciary Committee, the White House and civil liberty groups. The push back has been a result of the opaque process, lack of consultation with other committees of jurisdiction, clear violation of the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878, lack of due process and basic Constitutional protections and an indefinite extension of the so-called war on terror. No president should ever be handed this kind of power to use against American citizens."

Obama's White House is pushing back on this bill, not because he's against indefinite detention of American citizens without charge, but because the existing language make it mandatory to assign accused citizens to miliary detention and he doen't have the right to except anyone.

What a world you conservatives have wrought. To quote Buffington's drunken rants on this board, "I told you idiots so". You can't support indefinite detentions without charge and torture of "others" without it becoming domestic policy too.

LF

[longfisher]

In support of this harmful bill, Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) explained that the bill will “basically say in law for the first time that the homeland is part of the battlefield” and people can be imprisoned without charge or trial “American citizen or not.” Another supporter, Sen. Kelly Ayotte (R-N.H.) also declared that the bill is needed because “America is part of the battlefield.”

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/secre...#ixzz1f2rhATSK

Just what we'd expect from Republicans. They yell at the top of their lungs about freedom and then sit idly by and allow their Republican senators and reps to throw absolutely all of it out the window.

LF

[Glenn W]

Editorial coments regarding the balancing of current needs, fascism, and or rights of due process aside, I wouldn't fret too much about the bill passing as originally written. Even if it did pass the Senate and House floors, the President would veto it. And even if a veto was somehow overturned then by Congress (which is not realistically possible), the bill (law) would never get past the Supreme Court on Constituational grounds.---- In short, don't sweat what will never happen.

[longfisher]

Editorial coments regarding the balancing of current needs, fascism, and or rights of due process aside, I wouldn't fret too much about the bill passing as originally written. Even if it did pass the Senate and House floors, the President would veto it. And even if a veto was somehow overturned then by Congress (which is not realistically possible), the bill (law) would never get past the Supreme Court on Constituational grounds.---- In short, don't sweat what will never happen.

An amendment in the Senate which was intended to strip the bill of this language was defeated today.

LF

[longfisher]

Part 1

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/we...ed-development

Part 2

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/we...train-to-gitmo

Those of you, like me, who don't like Obama will love the first 10 seconds of Part 2. In those 10 seconds alone, Obama defeats himself for me in his relection bid for 2012.

LF

[longfisher]

Editorial coments regarding the balancing of current needs, fascism, and or rights of due process aside, I wouldn't fret too much about the bill passing as originally written. Even if it did pass the Senate and House floors, the President would veto it. And even if a veto was somehow overturned then by Congress (which is not realistically possible), the bill (law) would never get past the Supreme Court on Constituational grounds.---- In short, don't sweat what will never happen.

Obama caves and will sign indefinite detention bill:

http://loyalopposition.blogs.nytimes...sident-caving/

LF

[longfisher]

Editorial coments regarding the balancing of current needs, fascism, and or rights of due process aside, I wouldn't fret too much about the bill passing as originally written. Even if it did pass the Senate and House floors, the President would veto it. And even if a veto was somehow overturned then by Congress (which is not realistically possible), the bill (law) would never get past the Supreme Court on Constituational grounds.---- In short, don't sweat what will never happen.

It did change but only marginally. All the original powers that were intended to be conveyed to the President to allow unfettered endless military detention of American citiizens arrested on U.S. soil without charge is intact.

The President has said he'll sign it. These are the same exact powers that Stalin used in his reign of terror. These are the same exact powers that all heritary kings and other monarchs used for centuries before the Magna Carta. These are the tools of despots and enemies of the Constitution.

I hope he declares Frank and Buffington terrorists and detains them both indefinitely without charge. It really can happen now. It really can.

Some f*cking police state you guys wound up with. Are you happy now? We're returning to the days of McCarthyism.

LF

[longfisher]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgMRB...layer_embedded

I particularly liked the part about Americans not being in the Land of the Free and the Home of the Brave, but rather, that America is a land of great fear, particularly the Republicans, but Dems don't get off the hook either.

LF

[longfisher]

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories...MPLATE=DEFAULT

Virtually, everything Glenn W said wouldn't happen with this bill has, indeed, happened. It didn't die in the Senate. It was signed rather than vetoed by Obama. And, in a earlier Supreme Court ruling the Supreme's created precedent for the limitless detention of American citizens in America without charge and without access to the civilian courts because their detention can be maintained in secret.

Nice work weak-willed Glenn W!

Ron Paul may have some off-center ideas, but he'd certainly work to strike down this law. That's enough for my vote.

LF

[longfisher]

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/en...,5919114.story

LF