Charter boating is over

[bigeasy]

http://hamptonroads.com/2008/06/hurt...-all-same-boat


Open the article above. This was never a get rich scheme.

We can thank the people who stand in the way of increasing domestic energy supplies for the fuel mess.

What puzzles me is that we will reelect all those incompetents who are acting against our interests.

[JOE_DIRT]

I, for one, am not going to be able to afford to go as much as I like. A 6 person charter this year will cost $400 a man. At that price, I may only be able to make 1-2 trips. It's not just charters, either. We cancelled our trip to Canada this year because of elevated travel expenses. We are still in the air about a Disney trip in the fall. The cost of living has definately made me pay more attention to the extras I like to do.

[Doubled]

soo true. I feel bad for the guys that are the owner/operators of these charter boats. It should get better though. For you guys out there. Keep your chin ups. People will fish, it is just going to take a little push to get them on the boat.

[evileye]

I feel for you guys. It's always been a tough way to make a living. Let's hope Congress will wake up and allow domestic drilling. Not only to lower prices but to protect all who call the USA home. By the way Cliff. I fished 6 trips with Chuck back in 95,96 and 97. He was running on the Harper's Folley for giants then. Great mate, learned a lot from him. Hope all is well.

[Glenn W]

[url]We can thank the people who stand in the way of increasing domestic energy supplies for the fuel mess.

What puzzles me is that we will reelect all those incompetents who are acting against our interests.

Doc,
There is no doubt that the current state of soaring oil prices will drive many recreational fishing offshore charter operations out of business. That is a crying shame.
I don't pretend to know what the future will hold for your industry, but pointing a wicked finger as a red herring in a blame game is not going to help the situation or reduce oil prices, I'm afraid.
By no stretch of the imagination could I be considered a left wing, tree hugging environmentalist. On the other hand, a responsible, and most of all practical, steward of our environment is a responsibility rightfully imposed on our government. Indeed, my opinion on this matter of "increasing domestic energy supplies" is based on facts (as I understand them) and benefits v. costs of the alternatives you advocate.
Let's talk about this ANWR issue. For the record, if opening up ANWR to oil production would have any material impact on oil prices I'd say you might have a leg to stand on. The Problem is,
virtually every credible source has indicated that potential oil coming out of ANWR and transported through TAPs would have virtually NO impact on oil prices.
Consider the following--- and correct me if my data is wrong, skewed, or otherwise inappropriate: World oil production is about 85 million bbl/day. The most that ANWR could produce and transport to market is about 0.9 million bbl/day--- and that would not be achievable for 12 to 15 years. For sake of arguement, assume this 0.9 million bbl/day could be made available tomorrow. As we all know, oil prices are determined in a world market such that it makes no difference if it comes from your Uncle Sam's back yard or from some Arab's sand castle camel ranch--- the world oil market don't give a shit who wears red, white and blue. Now, again for arguement's sake, let's assume that an increase in world supply of slightly more than 1% could somehow have a significant impact on world oil prices (which it cannot). Consider the Arab Countries that have so much money and cash now that they can easy ride out this new supply. Remember, Countries like Kuwait, Quatar, SA, UAE, etc have so much cash frankly, they don't know what to do with it all now. One thing these Arabs do know is that there ain't but so much in the ground and when it's gone, it's gone--- they are very assute at maximizing the present and future value of this cash flow. So what would Opec do about this piddly, piss on a campfire new supply that somehow decreased their profits? ( remember, in reality, it would not impact prices to any material degree)--- It is obvious, they would cut back production by an equal or greater amount. Hey, they still have the oil under their sand dunes--- it ain't going no where--- save it till prices are better. I will give you this, I would imagine there would be a very short-term downward impact on oil futures prices with an announcement-- your guess is as good as mine on how long this ridiculous market would react-- but it would not be long on such meaningless news.
What are the costs of opening up ANWR?--- Honestly it is a moot point as demonstrated above. To me the biggest cost is the breach of trust and broken promise WE as a soociety made when we set this wilderness aside as a wildlife refuge. I don't know how many Carabou would be harmed--- my guess is the species would get along just fine though. The Snow Geese, Pintails, Swans, and other migratory birds?--- probabally they will get along ok as well. What if there were an oil spill?--- well shit would hit the political fan, but nature would recover. What wouldn't recover is the breach of our promise to set this land aside forever. Most important is that the breach of promise was for absolutley nothing. If the opening of ANWR could have a significant impact on oil prices or help our "self serving, take it all from the world's resources now and future generations be damned" society--- well, you might have a valid arguement. Unfortunatly I see no benefits to this action. Americans and our government have broken enough promises, why break more with nothing of value to gain?---then again, it would take a red herring away, and we all know this is a favorite tool for political debate.
Intelligent rebuttal welcome. Otherwise, pardon me while I ***** at a really stupid environmetal policy--- closing ORV use for bird nesting on a bird that rearely uses the closed beach to begin with.

[Deep C]

I see an adaptation swing that will be necessry before long. The long range trips are gonna hurt and those distances will need to be narrowed.
In the sixties the reason Palm Beach was a hot destination was because the fish were just a few minutes from the dock. In a day when ten knots was the norm, 15 was quick and 20 was a rocket, the canyons were a hard place to even get to. In Jersey the runs were usually bass, blues or mud hole tuna. Even in the obx the runs were an hour or two...

Economics ugly as they are will dictate what is and isn't. Its cheaper to jump on a plane and come down to south Florida and charter for a few days than a serious single canyon trip will cost.
The boss and I have talked about when we get the new boat about possible stray charter or two. The only way i see that working would be to fish a place like Chub where we are fishing a 1/4 mile from the dock and burning little or no fuel.

[bigeasy]

their majority in congress. Their will be no drilling in this country and very little else in energy production. We will continue to see our industry drift away to other countries that have a "favorable business climate".

The congress will succeed in getting past the "cap and trade" legislation which is a massive tax scheme on oil companies, utilities, refiners who will pass these taxes on to the consumers. This is designed to further discourage the use of fuels by again raising the cost of energy.

We are entering a new era of massive government controls. We will see a shrinking of our economy, unemployment, food shortages, people unable to heat their homes.

Much of this is to please the Global Warming crowd pushing an absurd agenda of apocalypse. Poor science. How long would you have to study any trend on a 4 billion year subject to have statistical significance.

In my opinion its all b------t.

[NJPete]

While i am sure everyone at the dock will feel the effects of the soaring fuel prices, i had an alternative thought with regard to charter fishing... now this might be a streach but...

If people are getting out of their boats (selling, dry docking,etc) for the summer or simply dont want to fuel up, but they still want to go out and fish, wouldnt that equate to an increase in the charter boating business? I'm an addict so i would pay, but i have to think that there are others who rather then fueling their boat, (or even having a boat for that matter) might turn to a professional to put them into fish.

Maybe its wishful thinking for the charter industry, but i cant help but think theres some validity to the notion.

[bigeasy]

While i am sure everyone at the dock will feel the effects of the soaring fuel prices, i had an alternative thought with regard to charter fishing... now this might be a streach but...

If people are getting out of their boats (selling, dry docking,etc) for the summer or simply dont want to fuel up, but they still want to go out and fish, wouldnt that equate to an increase in the charter boating business? I'm an addict so i would pay, but i have to think that there are others who rather then fueling their boat, (or even having a boat for that matter) might turn to a professional to put them into fish.

Maybe its wishful thinking for the charter industry, but i cant help but think theres some validity to the notion.

There will be business failures. Some will survive. People will want to continue to enjoy the outdoors. The better funded operations may continue to operate.

But my point is that what is hitting the charter industry so hard is going to effect everything in the US. Trucking, airlines, or anything that uses significant energy is very vulnerable.

We are looking at a reduced standard of living.

I believe some drilling, some nuclear plants would burst the speculative bubble. The speculators have a clear signal that the US is out of the competitive loop.

[LBlume]

I tend to agree with Cliff. If we would take advantage of some of our domestic options it would have some effect on oil prices,, maybe not instantly, but in time. Not only do we have oil available in ANWR but there are vast areas of the Gulf of Mexico that we are not allowed to drill in. Oil shale is also another option. There are also large amounts of natural gas in ANWR which would help with home heating costs. We have a congress in place that is bending over to environmental lobby. I agree that we should protect the environment but if we can safely explore these energy sources we should. Unfortunatly there has not been a viable alternative to oil created and until there is a competitive alternative energy source found we need to use what we have. I saw the governor of Alaska on tv last night. It is amazing to me that they produce a large amount of our domestic oil yet they have the highest gas prices in the country. Something seems wrong with that picture.
I hope Cliff is wrong about charter fishing being over. Most of my people are sucking it up and paying the increased prices. I just don't know for how long.